I catch up with Turid Rugaas, who I first met at a conference at Cambridge, where she introduced her ideas on calming signals and reading dogs to many people in the UK for the first time. I immediately got where she was coming from, unlike some of the audience, as we both remember. We get to chat here about her early life (with horses) but also the issue of control, and our shared concern over what seems to be a growing tendency not to allow a dog to make mistakes, and learn from them. A focus on control using external reinforcement might not be helping dogs develop emotional resilience. A great chat.